Investment proposal amid the crisis

Hello Madeleine, I can understand where you are coming from but I have a big BUT! The rider and horse, AI or not, would still be being noted by the judges who function as they currently do. Perhaps that is where the investment is needed most, changing judging methods and education on what is acceptable. Kind regards, Valerie

Thanks for the answer Valérie.

I don't think judges are really a problem for this. They see a good balance. They may take some points off, wanting a steadier contact, but the rider gets more point in quality of collected gaits, transitions and figures.
Maybe some judges would really put bad scores, but the majority, I am sure, see a good work.

But indeed, what the judges should do is stop putting good score for bad piaffe, passage, trot extension. This is the only thing I would blame judges for.
No ?

Hello Madeleine, so why do you think the judges give good scores for bad piaffe, passage and trot extensions?
Is it their ignorance, lack of knowledge on the subject, or subjective personal preferences? If it is any of these reasons then they should not be judging at all! If they give good scores for bad whatever then perhaps they need educating on how to recognise good paces ridden and obtained harmoniously and without resistance. As I said, this is where the investment is needed. Kind regards, Valerie

Hi!

After watching the Olympics, there were not many horses which did a true Piaffe - perhaps the judges have just got use to this 'type' of Piaffe and have forgotten what a really good one looks like!
How many had the poll as the highest point? the face near the vertical? The quarters lowered? Even I, as as a real amateur, could see this, so why the high scores?

Also when watching young horse classes, the priority seems to be on really DRIVING the young horse forward onto the bit.

The muscular harmony as described by Colonel Carde is just not presented to the judges anymore, so they have learnt to accept the alternative.....from this the competitors try to offer the judges that which they are use to seeing ...and hence the circle continues!

Hello Samantha,
I enjoyed your posting and agree with your views and I have quoted one which has always bothered me...Your quote: "Also when watching young horse classes,the priority seems to be on really DRIVING the young horse forward onto the bit." I am always reminded by one of the Colonel's comments'WE MUST BRING THE HORSE TO IT'S BIT BY A LATERAL FLEXION RATHER THAN BY DRIVING IT ONTO THE BIT'.If we are careful about this,and ensure that our horses are active,with a constant urge to go forward,not faster,then they will drive themselves.
I hope you agree,
Sandy.

ACRES Samantha écrit:

Hi!

perhaps the judges have just got use to this 'type' of Piaffe and have forgotten what a really good one looks like!
How many had the poll as the highest point? the face near the vertical? The quarters lowered? Even I, as as a real amateur, could see this, so why the high scores?
Hi Samantha, couldn't agree more with you, the performances were less than harmonious, the discomfort of some of the horses so obvious,so why the high scores?

The muscular harmony as described by Colonel Carde is just not presented to the judges anymore, so they have learnt to accept the alternative.....from this the competitors try to offer the judges that which they are use to seeing ...and hence the circle continues!

Hopefully people such as the Colonel, Heuschmann, Horses for Life, etc can help break this circle and evolve a more respectful (of the horse) competiton dressage and judging techniques. Not just financial investment needed though! Best wishes, Valerie

Hello Valerie and Sandy!

Yes, I quite agree with you Sandy. We need more Colonel Cardes and Sylvia Lochs around the world to put things back to how they should be!

Valerie, do you not think that finance is actually the real problem within dressage today. People are breeding young horses and, in wanting to make a 'buck', they need to produce the young horse quickly so that the person buying it thinks that it has potential to go on to a high level and will therefore pay more money for it.
Obviously this, in association with judges forgetting to read and re-read the FEI rules and to apply them, causes the horse to suffer in the long run (and short term!)

Hello Samantha, money has ruined a lot of sports, horses and the dressage world are now in the same boat. I have ideas and opinions on the subject that are not necessarily ideal fodder for this forum. I am against "breeding the perfect dressage horse" and the money that is invested in such projects because folks will pay a higher price and so on and so on. I fear that judges are actually compromised on the circuit concerning how they note/mark. Or do they really no longer recognise what is a good piaffe, extended trot or whatever? On the Horse for Life magazine there was a photo of an Olympic horse's head in a flash noseband so tightly cinched up he could not relax his jaw and it was interfering with his breathing, the nostrils were terribly distended trying to get air in! Are there no controls on equipment, for example, the two-finger rule for comfortable nose-bands? Sorry, this is turning into a bit of a rant. It's a big subject though that needs to be addressed. In any case, I find no pleasure in watching the so called 'high level' dressage performances, too many riders riding with the brakes on, horses with stiff backs and faulty diagonalisation. We need more people to speak out such as Gerd Heuschmann has done. On that note, I will go and prepare dinner and calm down with a glass of very good St. Emilion wine!! A bientôt, Valerie

Hello Samantha, money has ruined a lot of sports, horses and the dressage world are now in the same boat. I have ideas and opinions on the subject that are not necessarily ideal fodder for this forum. I am against "breeding the perfect dressage horse" and the money that is invested in such projects because folks will pay a higher price and so on and so on. I fear that judges are actually compromised on the circuit concerning how they note/mark. Or do they really no longer recognise what is a good piaffe, extended trot or whatever? On the Horse for Life magazine there was a photo of an Olympic horse's head in a flash noseband so tightly cinched up he could not relax his jaw and it was interfering with his breathing, the nostrils were terribly distended trying to get air in! Are there no controls on equipment, for example, the two-finger rule for comfortable nose-bands? Sorry, this is turning into a bit of a rant. It's a big subject though that needs to be addressed. In any case, I find no pleasure in watching the so called 'high level' dressage performances, too many riders riding with the brakes on, horses with stiff backs and faulty diagonalisation. We need more people to speak out such as Gerd Heuschmann has done. On that note, I will go and prepare dinner and calm down with a glass of very good St. Emilion wine!! A bientôt, Valerie

I agree with you and it's always good to know there are people who question themselves and their training.

In the latest issue of the US dressage federation, there is an article about the noseband and every trainer advise at least two fingers gap... (of course!). But what a lot of professionals don't do, mainly because they think a tight one give more control, and they don't take the time to think about it.
A lot of people working with horses are afraid to lose control of their horse, falling, bucking... The irony is that they would be much better off if they would build a confortable stressless environment for their horse - that then would be relaxed and paying attention, and less likely to act up.

As for the public, if they were showed something radically different from the bad modern piaffe (etc), they will maybe start questionning the main stream drawing reins, side reins training that gives the nice neck but ruins the back (hence terrible piaffe and so on).

And judges would maybe stop judging despondently... Maybe !

Hence my proposal !

Anyway...... We'll see, it seems to me that things are starting to change.